As the festive season approaches, Iole spoke with business psychologist Jennifer about balancing caregiving and career, why caring remains a hidden burden and how carers and employers can create meaningful support.
Iole: Welcome to this MYNDUP Community Conversation ‘Handle with care’, where we explore the challenges of balancing work and caring responsibilities during the festive season. The holidays can be particularly difficult for carers, with additional responsibilities, escalating time pressures, and the emotional complexities that arise during this sentimental time of year. Today, we're examining caring contexts and trends, exploring the different phases of caring, and discussing practical strategies to manage the unique pressures of the season. We'll look at caring from a distance, the challenges of the "sandwich generation," and share tips for managing guilt and resentment. We'll also explore how workplaces can better support their caring employees.
I'm delighted to welcome Jennifer Liston-Smith, a business psychologist, coach, and organisational consultant who has spent over 20 years working with organisations globally on managing work - family balance, caring responsibilities, and wellbeing. Beyond her professional expertise, Jennifer brings personal experience as a carer, which we'll weave into our conversation today.
Jennifer: Thank you, Iole. Great to be here and welcome everybody that's joined. We know if you are a carer, by definition, you are busy. So, thank you so much for investing this time to be with us together.
Who are today's carers?
Iole: Before we begin, let's get a sense of who's in the room with us. We ran a quick poll asking about caring responsibilities, and the results are revealing. 50% of our audience is caring for an adult or ageing parent, 25% are caring for adult children with additional needs, another 25% for children with additional needs, and 50% for children generally. This speaks to the multiple and varied caring needs represented here today. It's worth noting that not everyone voted, which reflects a common reality: carers aren't always visible.
Jennifer: Absolutely. I'm always struck by the statistics around unpaid carers. In the UK, for example, the contribution that unpaid carers make is equivalent to the entire cost of the NHS, roughly £184 billion in economic contribution. That's enormous. But beyond the economic value, caring is one of the most fundamentally human things we can do. Particularly in an age of AI, valuing what we do that is so intimately human is crucial.
Iole: That recognition is so important. The fact that caring is such an overlooked workforce is partly because many carers don't even identify themselves as carers. Before we dive deeper, it's worth considering some sobering statistics: 20% of the global workforce has some caring responsibilities, and 74% of those carers say they feel stressed or anxious. More than half have lost touch with friends or family, experienced physical health decline due to the stress of caring, and feel lonely.
The current landscape of caring in the workplace
Iole: What are you hearing in conversations around caring in the workplace right now?
Jennifer: In the UK, we had the introduction of carers leave in April 2024 - a statutory unpaid leave that allows someone caring for an adult or other relative to request up to five days off per year. It's a positive step. However, I think the focus has gone too heavily towards time out of work. The other thing that's so crucial is not just getting people that protected time out of work, but how do we support time in work as well? The caring role is often what gives us our sense of identity, our stability, our sanity sometimes.
Iole: That's really interesting. When things feel overwhelming, one's instinct is to say, "I can't do this anymore." But that's where an employer or a community can really support you to get through that phase so that you can stay in work.
Jennifer: Exactly. There are certainly times when we've all thought, "Should I give up work?" But if we sit down and think longer term, we sometimes realise staying in work is one of the things that's going to keep us steady. Sometimes we have to persuade our workplace that giving us a little bit of flexibility will be really worthwhile in the long term.
The different phases of caring
Iole: In terms of the phases that we come across in caring, what is particularly helpful to think about?
Jennifer: If being a carer is a new thing, we need to allow ourselves to weather a period of shock initially. Caring can happen quite suddenly. There's a period of shock and adjustment. Then there are other phases. Sometimes those are phases of sustaining energy. It might be that we're wrestling with admin, with legal tasks, or managing medical care. Then sometimes there's an end-of-life phase that we really want to be present for. And then there may well be a grief phase. We have to acknowledge there are these different phases and find places that we can acknowledge that.
Iole: You make a good point around not committing to something forever because this may change.
Jennifer: Absolutely. If we have a flexible working application, maybe do that in a temporary way, to pilot it for three months. The other practical point I would make is: because we are so busy as carers, we have to find micro-breaks in a day. Even if it's just reminding myself every time I go through a doorway to breathe and relax.
Caring from a distance
Iole: An added complexity that can sometimes happen is that we often have parents who don't live close to us, or we have people we need to care about who don't live close to us. I had parents in South Africa while I was in the UK. They were ageing, one got sick. Much more difficult when they're far away. What tips, tools, or ideas would you share with people who might have this as a challenge?
Jennifer: It's very real for many of us, particularly for people who have maybe grown up in one country and then moved and are having a career in another. I think it helps to think about the emotional side and the practical side.
Practical considerations
Some of what's going on on the practical side is the logistics of coordinating across distance and across time zones, which can be really challenging - health systems and other support. The key is to think about the systems that you need. Video calls, online calls with doctors or care staff, coordinating group chats for siblings and family members. Maybe being the person who sets up a WhatsApp or other chat with the family so that people are kept informed.
It's often quite common for one person to become the one that family relies upon, and that can be very difficult. Not only difficult because it's a lot to carry, but also difficult because you might come to a decision - whether it's making a decision together with an older parent about going into a care home or having carers into the house - and you've gone through all the pros and cons, and then you share that with other family members and immediately they're saying, "Oh, Mum's fine, she can manage," and you have to re-explain. Whereas if you can bring people in earlier on through group chats, then you might well have a clearer pathway to it.
Carers UK has an app called Jointly, which is worth looking up and that gives you a place to coordinate care. That really helps you look at medications if people are sharing the load, to make sure that a family member or friend is getting medications or treatment plans. Things like that really help.
Ideally, having local contacts - if you can get neighbours' phone numbers or even a professional that's nearby - having those to hand is very helpful. You may need them at short notice.
Iole: I love what you say about having people's contact details and knowing stuff. Probably with ageing parents, that's something you can do in advance because you know it's inevitable they will age, so maybe that's something to think about before you need to.
Jennifer: Yes. And obviously, engage the individual themselves, the loved one. One of the dynamics - I've cared for my two parents who are no longer with us, but in different ways, I joined in with my sister in caring for both of them. I think one of the things that we all experience, if we have cared or are caring for a parent, is that shift. We were once the child and they cared for, and then they’ve become the dependent.
We will probably all have experienced how hard that is and how the ageing individual wants to stay independent and doesn't want to give up that sense of freedom and choice. So really involve the individual in those choices - and as you say, Iole, the sooner you do it the better, when that person is more well and able to take a view on that and say, "Well, actually, I'd like Irene to be involved, not Beth."
Emotional considerations
Iole: There's a strong emotional component too this isn’t there?
Jennifer: That's absolutely right. Think about what we can share so it doesn't just become a duty. Can we share photos at a distance? Can we occasionally eat a meal together? At this time of year, you might be lighting Diwali lights or opening doors on an advent calendar together. Sometimes we have to push our own imagination a little bit. A lot of it is about engagement, not just presence. Maybe have a little phrase you remember to bring to mind, such as, "They looked after me when I was a baby. They got up for me in the night," or, "I might need my own children this way one day," or even just a word like "calm." I'm not talking about us trying to be good - this is not about us being nice. It's actually self-preservation, because the more I get emotionally activated in those moments, the less I'm going to be able to get back to sleep afterwards.
If I can deal with it calmly, keep it contained, we can resolve the situation hopefully, and then I can hopefully move on calmly. Some of it is also about self-management in those moments. Of course, we're trying to underline guidelines on time zones and remind the person at good times that we can call. But sometimes we can't ignore the call because it could be a real emergency.
Iole: I love the idea of a positive trigger word, something that triggers a positive emotion. That's really nice. It sounds like what you're really speaking about is reframing, because I think caring can often, when you're tired and you're stressed and you're feeling overwhelmed, feel like a real imposition. What you're talking about is finding some of the joy of being with that person and caring for that person.
The sandwich generation and circles of support
Iole: I suppose this leads nicely on to what we speak about as the sandwich generation, which is an increasing demographic of people who have ageing parents and young children and are having to manage both ends of the spectrum simultaneously. You work as a coach and as a consultant - are there any tools that you share that you find are really helpful for people, both the sandwich generation but anyone who has these caring responsibilities?
Jennifer: The circles of support is often what I turn to. The idea of this is to map out our support network, to think about everyone who is or could be in our circle of support. If they're not at the moment, how could we engage them? Add in immediate family, siblings, friends, neighbours, colleagues at work, health professionals, and other people in the community.
Don’t just put them in rings depending on how close they are in terms of family or wider professionals, but actually to think about how close they are in terms of how much support they're giving. It could be that a particular colleague at work is right in the centre of my support circles because that's the person that I can talk to when I'm at my wits' end and I just need to say how hard it is, and they listen and probably don't try to fix it for me but just empathise and hear.
Then maybe there's a sibling who's right out in an outer circle because currently they don't get it. They are not really involved. Sometimes it's easier if you've got somebody like that to practise asking for the support we need, the help we need, the contribution we'd like them to make - to identify something they could do.
Sometimes we need to - I know this takes time and we're busy and energy is scarce - but sooner or later we probably need to, every once in a while or once a quarter or something like that, just take stock. What do my support circles look like right now? Because this is something that's hard to do alone, and we need to get good at asking for the support we need.
Iole: That's so important. What strikes me as you go through this is, looking at the neighbours, they're not the people you would naturally just think of. But of course, I have neighbours who are really accessible, who have a key to my flat, who are really helpful. So they would be a brilliant resource if I ever needed anything. I presume you can expand this as much as you want in terms of where you live, who you have access to in this country, nearer to your family, those sorts of things.
Jennifer: Absolutely. It may be that help comes from the most unexpected places. Somebody who - maybe you've got children and it's another parent at your children's school who also turns out to be a carer, and you just stumble across this at child drop-off time, and suddenly that is a person you really want to engage as a buddy. You might say to them, "Could we have a chat? I'd love to just share my experience with you." The handout will be shared at the end of the session so you can practice this activity yourself.
Practising the conversation
Iole: You've also spoken a bit about practising. I wonder if you could just talk to this a little bit.
Jennifer: Sometimes it's not obvious how much we are carrying if we're doing it well, as many of us are. Sometimes we're wearing a bit of a mask at work because we've got to bring our A-game. It's very different from much of parenting. I recognise there are very different experiences of parenting, and sometimes there are additional needs. However, a lot of parenting is something that we can talk about in the workplace - there are funny moments and universally shared experiences of just lack of sleep or children being messy, rooms not being tidy, and so on, which most people can relate to. Whereas having washed Mum before coming to work, or fed Dad before coming to work, is harder to talk about in some ways. When we don't talk about it, nobody knows what we're carrying.
So sometimes, finding ways that we are comfortable sharing what we have on our plates - again, practising, practising out loud, practising on our own or practising with a friend, especially if we wanted to talk to our manager to say, "I would really like a little bit more flexibility on a Friday when there's an important hospital appointment for my parent," or whatever it is. Just to be able to find a sentence where I can say that calmly without feeling too upset, without feeling that I'm saying more than I want to. That whole kind of practising out loud and being really clear what we're asking for is really a skill that we need to and can develop.
Iole: I think we underestimate the value of practice because so often when we eventually decide to say something, we're emotional. We're already upset, we're already angry, we're already feeling whatever we're feeling, and so it comes out badly. I think we've all said things where we've thought, "I wish I hadn't said it like that." So the practice is an incredibly useful tip.
Managing guilt and resentment
Iole: It's really easy to both have guilt and resentment. How do you manage the sense of not doing enough but also the resentment of doing too much?
Jennifer: That's absolutely the conundrum. We might, in honesty, feel angry about our caring responsibilities sometimes. Sometimes we have to sit with the emotion. Take the next five breaths and breathe out as much as you breathe in. Recognise the emotion and stop it taking us over. Sometimes we have to give emotions a place and then identify that the emotion is not the whole of me.
Iole: For people supporting carers, the other way you can be helpful is to give them space to feel what they feel.
Jennifer: Yeah. People will often ask me how my husband's doing, and they often forget to ask how I'm doing. Sometimes we also have to voice the fact that we just need to be able to talk about ourselves sometimes and what we need.
Iole: Reflecting on how much you already do is important.
Jennifer: Maybe sometimes just sit down at the end of the day and think about what we've done that is 110% very often. Before we're going to sleep, reflect on three things that went really well. And sometimes also, what are we grateful for?
Iole: A done list is quite a nice habit for that.
Jennifer: We have to find those moments where we can care for ourselves because you can't pour from an empty vessel. Even if we struggle to do what we think is selfish, it's actually not selfish. It's the only way of sustaining our caring role and our career.
Workplace support for carers
Iole: Workplace support is what I'd love to touch on as we come towards the end of the conversation. You mentioned at the beginning what an incredible resource carers are to a workplace, and a supportive workplace, as some of the people in the chat have said, can make the world of difference. When you work with corporates and when you work with organisations, what do you normally recommend to make them supportive for someone who's a carer?
Jennifer: I think the easiest win is to encourage networks – networks of carers. Even a small group helps, whether online or in person. People can drop in when they can, share experiences, or discuss practical tips. Shared resources or online forums also work well.
Training managers is crucial. Enable managers to spot when people are overwhelmed, open conversations, and offer flexibility. Line managers who are carers themselves can role-model sharing their experience, which positively affects organisational culture. Small gestures matter too. Trust staff to deliver outcomes in ways that suit their caring responsibilities. When employers meet individuals with understanding and flexibility, loyalty payback is huge. These are often the people carrying significant responsibilities.
Iole: And much of what you’ve suggested is low or no cost. Networks don’t have to be initiated by the organisation – individuals can champion them.
Jennifer: Absolutely. If setting up a carers network, having co-chairs or a small committee helps. You might ask HR or inclusion teams for a small budget for coffee mornings or external speakers. Recognise the people running the network, and carve out time for them and carers to attend.
Iole: Many workplaces aren’t aware of the hidden caring workforce. Practising conversations and raising it with your employer can be the first step. Once HR recognises the need, they’re often quick to respond.
Jennifer: So true.
Iole: We've both in our experience worked a lot with providing psychosocial and coaching support, but I think organisations can also do quite a lot in terms of practical support. MYNDUP is there to support carers - obviously we support with counselling, coaching, therapy - but there are a lot of resources out there that employers can pay for. There is a paid opportunity as well to support staff.
Jennifer: I would also say, thinking about MYNDUP, we were talking about having an ally that you can talk to. What better than a professional at the other end of a call where there's no reservation about worrying if I'm complaining? That's the place to do it. If we just need somebody to listen and then to help us navigate through the mist and figure out what's next, that's such a great place to go.
Iole: Absolutely. We'd really encourage people to use that opportunity, because I think we've had some conversation in the chat around guilt, around grief. Often you grieve the change in your life when this happens, and so speaking to someone with experience around that can be incredibly helpful.
Questions from the audience
Iole: We've had some questions in the Q&A, and Jennifer, maybe I can ask you this question. Do you have any tips that partners of people with caring needs can do to best help their partners in these situations, and ways that they can help themselves to look after the relationship where one partner has really been overwhelmed by caring needs?
Jennifer: My heart goes out to you. I can see that this is challenging. It's particularly challenging - it's a relationship and a caring responsibility you've taken on through a partner. So it's a partner's child in one case, and it's become much more demanding. You're asking what you can do to support, and you're also asking what you can do to help with your mental health.
I think one of the keys is talking and honest conversation, and to encourage both of you to talk about your needs. One of the keys here, which is about how we talk to each other, is talking about "I." I'll say more about this in a moment - talking about "I" rather than "you."
When we get into "you," we're often blaming. "You never think about me," or, "You haven't done enough," or, "I didn't see you getting up in the night the other night to help." When we talk about "I," it's about my needs. It's often harder - it's instinctively easier to blame another person, kind of just the way we're wired, and especially when we're feeling angry. It's harder in a way to be assertive and say, "I'm feeling this. I'm feeling exhausted. I feel I'm a bit close to burnout," or, "I'm really worried," or, "I feel desperately sad about this situation," or, "I feel helpless that I can't be more used to you and I just don't know what to do." To put that out there.
So: how am I feeling, and what do I need? To be able to be clear about that and to encourage the other person, and perhaps if you can, ideally agree to listen to each other. If you start talking, or you invite your partner to talk, not to butt in one sentence when they say, "Well, I just need a break sometimes," and for you to say, "Well, I gave you a break last Tuesday." Just try to hold back and listen to each other.
Iole: I think that's so important. I think one of the difficulties - and I think we've had a few comments around that - is when you do sometimes share what you're going through, you can get caught with people trying to rescue you and offering you advice and telling you how to do things. Often you've tried everything, you've looked into everything. So I think being able to say to somebody, "I'd love to share this, but I really just would love you to listen," can be helpful to tell someone what you need. But also, if someone's coming to you, to understand that just listening is probably the best thing you can do for someone. You don't have to solve their problems.
Jennifer: Yes. And I would also say to remember self-compassion, because a lot of what's happening in caring is compassion. There's boundless compassion amongst the group here for the people that you're caring for, and we need to be compassionate to ourselves.
In that moment, yes, we'd love to be able to help, but we have to care for ourselves as well. So: "Yes, I can support you with that. Actually, I need to do it in five minutes, not just now, because I'm just finishing something else," or, "Yes, I can do that on Tuesday next week, I can't do it tonight," or whatever is negotiable and realistic. Just to not feel that it's selfish to negotiate, or indeed to say no. That is self-compassion, because you are as important as any of the other people in this equation - as your partner, as your partner's child, or whatever your formation of caring is. You are equally important.
Iole: That's so easy to forget. I think a couple of people have said they feel guilty about the level of compassion or support they're getting. It can be so easy to put everyone ahead of yourself. But as you spoke about, you can't pour from an empty cup. So in a way, your obligation to other people is to look after yourself, because otherwise you're not any help to anybody.
Another audience member asked, "How do you share this information about what you're going through without coming across as always complaining?"
Jennifer: Again, I think it's about finding the words. I often talk about offering, if it's a manager conversation for example, a solution rather than a problem. So instead of saying, "My adult son with additional needs is increasingly dependent and it's very difficult," and getting into it and perhaps feeling upset while talking about it, if we can start with, "I'd like to ask you if I can work from home once a week," or, "I'd like to ask you if I can come in later on Tuesdays because I've got this need."
If we can think about the solution - because the other person will probably feel empathy or sympathy and they'll want to figure out what's required of them. If we can make that clear up front - "This is what I'm asking for, can you help me with it?" - that clarity on what would help, and then the explanation as far as we think we need to share it.
If you're worried about complaining, I would say find one or two allies who don't mind and possibly have shared experience. Then, we have to gauge who wants to hear. To be honest, not everybody does want to hear. There'll be some people in the workplace who are just so busy with everything they're doing that it's sort of extra noise that they don't have the attention span for. So we have to pick our allies where we can have a deeper conversation, I would say.
Iole: Which is why those circles are so important - to identify who to go to for what thing.
Final thoughts
Iole: Any last thoughts, Jennifer? If you wanted people to go away with one thing, what would that be?
Jennifer: Focus on shared rituals, even at a distance. Map support networks and practise conversations. Collaborate with family, use apps to coordinate, and acknowledge what you’re carrying. Congratulate yourself, reward yourself, and remember your value in the workplace.
Iole: 100%. So as we come to the close, first of all, thank you, Jennifer, for sharing. Really appreciate your experience and your personal reflections on this. Thank you to everyone who joined today. As we said at the beginning, we appreciate you giving us an hour in what is an already overwhelmed life. Wishing you all a more balanced, supported, and gentle festive season. Lovely to have had everyone here, and we hope you found it helpful.
Jennifer: Pleasure to be with you.
Click here to watch the Community Conversation recording and download the Circles of Support handout here.
If you or someone you know is struggling to balance work and caring responsibilities, MYNDUP offers professional support through counselling, coaching, and therapy.